RhinoPower Ltd

TechSupport · Guru

RE: Hi and Help request

fordem · Senior Member

Thanks kostuch, you learn something new every day.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Hi, I got another one for you, is the OBD1's pin connections common to the diferent makes of car? I have found the layout for some honda's http://technet.ff-squad.com/wiring.obd1.htm and wanted to know if this is any good for my swifts ecu? (when i get it)

kostuch · Veteran Member

This is '93 samurai built for european market.

But all fuel injected samurais utilized VSV-ISC. I believe also 8v vitaras used this same device.

In fact this is very reliable and stable system. I've never heard about dead ISC.

fordem · Senior Member

What year Samurai do you have and what market (country) was it built for ?

Quite frankly - I'm having a difficulty wrapping my mind around the concept of driving those solenoids with a pulse train, the response time would be ridiculously laggy and solenoid life probably reduced - I have seen them used to control idle speed, either using a diaphragm to adjust an idle stop screw, or by introducing a controlled air bleed - both of which are on/off scenarios and not PWM.

kostuch · Veteran Member

Effectively such VSV acts as ISC in my samurai. PWM signal modulates amount of idle air.

kostuch · Veteran Member

fordem wrote:
Just to be clear ...
Are you referring to the ISC on the back of the throttle body - or the VSV in the post which you quoted?

VSV

I have no idea what for is this plastic device on the back.

fordem · Senior Member

As I said before, that's not an ISC - this is more than just semantics - you can find those vacuum switching valves on many vehicles, my Swift has them, and that has an Aisin carburettor, so they are not specific to fuel injected vehicles.

-- Edited by fordem on Saturday 20th of April 2013 10:30:04 PM

fordem · Senior Member

Just to be clear ...

Are you referring to the ISC on the back of the throttle body - or the VSV in the post which you quoted?

kostuch · Veteran Member

fordem wrote:
No - that's what's known as a VSV or vacuum switching valve - it's an electrically operated solenoid valve that either opens or closes a port between the two vacuum hoses when energized,

Almost identical ISC is used in 1,3i samurai.

I suspect, that samurai ecu can handle this engine - maybe not optimal...

Alternatively I would use megasquirt.

TechSupport · Guru

I don't have any ECUs for a 1.3 Swift; I think the majority of the Swifts sold in the UK at that time were 1litre models, I know that when I was looking for one the 1.3s were rather thin on the ground.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Does Rhino Power Ltd. have a reconditioned 33920-69E00 ECU available? or are they likely to in the near future?

fordem · Senior Member

Using the "black box" on the back of the throttle body as a reference and limiting the search to the European market area I come up with the SF413-3 & SF413-4

Both of these use the same ECUs - 33920-69E00 for a manual transmission & 33920-69E10 for automatic transmission.

TechSupport · Guru

Thats interesting, I have a 68E00 which is for a 1.0 and that is an ISC model, clearly there is some logic in the numbering. eBay Germany can be a good source of Suzuki ECUs.

-- Edited by Rhinoman on Monday 15th of April 2013 06:46:13 PM

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Wow thats great thank you very much indeed, now all I need to do is find one :) at least I know what to look for now!

Does any one have a manual one spare?

-- Edited by Phatwiji on Monday 15th of April 2013 09:43:54 PM

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

I have aquired some OBD1 conectors already so I hopefully when I get the right ECU I will just need to join up the wires in the right order, not easy but will figuer it out I hope. I dont know if it helps at all but I made a note of the engine no. G13BA502661. Good luck in the morning and thanks.

TechSupport · Guru

On the parts database the model(s) with the ISC needs to be determined and then the ECU part numbers for those models can be looked up.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Rhinoman wrote:
You need an OBD1 ECU that will run the ISC, theres probably a few that would work, its just matching up the numbers thats the problem.

When you say "matching up the numbers" what exactly do you mean?

fordem · Senior Member

I don't think a 98 would be an SF413-2, production of that body style would have stopped as early as 94 in some markets, but continued for a year or two more in others - I'll have a look in the morning and see what I can come up with. You're also missing a fair bit of the wiring harness - the entire section under the dash that has the ECU connectors will also be needed.

-- Edited by fordem on Sunday 14th of April 2013 02:41:15 PM

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

so what can I do now then, Whats the next step?

I never knew it would be this hard to find.

I must say thanks again for taking the time to help me out!

TechSupport · Guru

You need an OBD1 ECU that will run the ISC, theres probably a few that would work, its just matching up the numbers thats the problem.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Ok thanks, that is where the service book said the ISC was I just didnt know what I was looking at. So does this bring us any closer to identifing an ECU that will work with the enging?

TechSupport · Guru

That looks like an ISC system, the plastic box on the back of the throttle body is the motor. I can find a picture of it on the Suzuki database but there is no part number for it, maybe Fordem can find some info as he has a different parts database. I think its an SF413-2.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

here is a bunch of pictures of my engines injector unit, does this help anyone to identify what I am looking for in the way of an ecu? I may be clutching a bit at straws but i'm not sure what else to do at this point?

and this is what I have of the wiring loom

fordem · Senior Member

No - that's what's known as a VSV or vacuum switching valve - it's an electrically operated solenoid valve that either opens or closes a port between the two vacuum hoses when energized,

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

is this the ISC?

TechSupport · Guru

Idle Speed Controller or Idle Air Controller, the FSM lhas sections for each type.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Rhinoman wrote:
Do you know if you've got the ISC valve or the IAC?

Good qusetion im not even sure what they are? lol sorry

TechSupport · Guru

Do you know if you've got the ISC valve or the IAC?

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

The service manual that I have been using that has so far been the corect one and seems to have all the right pictures and diagrams etc. is the "SUZUKI, SF413, SUPPLEMENTRY SERVICE MANUAL, GS/GL/GLX WITH ELECTRONIC FUEL INJECTION SYSTEM"

I dont know if this helps you to identify it

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

there are several cars that run using the G13BA engine, are the ecu's of all of them so very diferent? everything is non-interchangable?

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

No sadly it was just chopped off there hmm I may be being stupid but does it need to be the exact sort that was with this engine or would it be possible to make a similer one work?

TechSupport · Guru

Nearly all the data that I have for these models is by VIN. Was there a connector at the bulkhead or has it been chopped? I may be able to match it to a wiring diagram.

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

I may be able to track down the VIN but dont count on it, is there any other approach to identifying the engine? Like the engine no. or somthing?

Thanks for helping

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

the service manual i'm using says there is an idle speed controller, and if memory serves I have seen somthing that looks like it may be it.

-- Edited by Phatwiji on Wednesday 10th of April 2013 10:21:25 PM

-- Edited by Phatwiji on Wednesday 10th of April 2013 11:06:18 PM

TechSupport · Guru

I have a couple of Swift ECUs, do you know the VIN of the vehicle that the engine came out of

Phatwiji · Veteran Member

Hi,

I was refered here by the guys at "Suzuki-Forums" as I am trying to find an ECU (or at least find out what ECU i'm looking for!)

I have spent some time now building a hybrid Mini with the enging and gearbox from a 1998 manual swift. See here for details on that http://www.16vminiclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30633

It is the G13BA engine and when taking it we got all the electrics from the bulkhead forward but neglected to get the ECU from under the dash (bummer) So I am now desperatly trying to find an ECU to run my engine.

Any help would be moste appreciated